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Joannes van Hees en Elisabeta Maria Reijnart

Martin (Tim) van Hees (Uit Canada) vertelde op 6 april 2011 om 18:20 uur
English to Dutch translation
Geen enkele informatie hebben over de voorouders van Joannes van Hees en Elisabeta Reijnart. Ze woonden in Heer, waar ze getrouwd op 28.4.1743. Hij is gedoopt in Heer op 19.5.1715. Ik denk dat zijn ouders waren Nicolaus van Hees en Gertrudis Rameeckers, maar ik ben niet zeker. De kerkelijke registers uit Limburg en de stad van de Heer, zijn niet duidelijk. Alle hulp zou worden gewaardeerd

Reacties (16)

Norah zei op 6 april 2011 om 20:12
Beste Tim,

Heer is en was een dorp vlakbij Maastricht gelegen.
Voor kerkelijke gegevens kan men beter kijken bij Maastricht zelf. De naam Rameeckers is trouwens een echte Limburgse familienaam.

Mvg, Norah
Tim zei op 6 april 2011 om 20:47
English to Dutch translation
Dank u Norah! Zijn er specifieke kerkelijke registers uit Maastricht dat ik kan on-line toegang via het internet, dat je je bewust bent van?
Norah zei op 7 april 2011 om 11:15
Dear Tim,

I am very sorry, but I can't give you the solution to find the exact registers on-line.The archives of this province are far more acessible than those of the province of
Limburg(countytown= Maastricht), on -line for that matter. I was born at Maastricht.
Maybe someone else will find the right answers you are looking for?

With kind regards, Norah
Ing. Gerard W. Ch. Lemmens zei op 7 april 2011 om 15:52
Dear Tim,

The Netherlands is divided into Provinces each with their own capital. This web is for the Province of Noord_brabant whereas you are looking for information from the town of Heer which is in the province of Noord-Limburg.
Have you tried www.google.nl and typ in - van Hees genealogie - or - Reijnart genealogie - ??
I know that Noord-Limburg has not got the facilities this web offers.

Good hunting,

Gerard Lemmens
Leo B. zei op 7 april 2011 om 17:27
De provincie heet Limburg en niet Noord-Limburg.

Ing. Gerard W. Ch. Lemmens zei op 7 april 2011 om 18:00
Dear Tim,

Leo has rightly corrected me ! It is not Noord-Limburg but Limburg !! What he does not know is that I have lived only a small (less then one third) part of my life in The Netherlands and I have forgotten a little !
But if you want to learn more about the Dutch Provinces :
http://nl.wikipedia.org/wiki/Provincies_van_Nederland

Good hunting,

Gerard
Dorethé zei op 7 april 2011 om 21:18
Tim, the regional archive in Limburg is the RHC Limburg in Maastricht and you can find them at http://www.rhcl.nl/settaal.asp?taal=gb (the English website). In the menu on the left point to or click Family history. There's a bulletin board too.
You can also take a look at FamilySearch for Dutch record collections(https://www.familysearch.org/s/collection/list#page=1&countryId=1927059). Here you'll find the Limburg Parish Register Transcripts, 1600-1822.
You can also order the GenDaLim cd-rom. For this cd-rom, take a look at http://gendawin.lggi.nl/.
Another source in Limburg is Rijckheyt, Center for Regional History (www.rijckheyt.nl, in Dutch only).
A general website for finding Dutch resources is www.geneaknowhow.net (also in English).
Tim zei op 7 april 2011 om 22:09
Thank you everyone for your help. I have tried the Limburg records, Maastricht records, BHIC, Geneology on-line, Family Search, and many others websites that you suggested. Unfortunately, I have had no success. Thank you again for your help! Sincerely, Tim
Dorethé zei op 7 april 2011 om 23:56
Tim, I think Nicolaus van Hees and Gertrudis Ramaeckers indeed could be the parents of Joannes van Hees (also Vanhees). On the GenDaLim7 cd-rom I found that their first son was baptised on 22-03-1744, his name was Nicolaus and the witnesses were Catharina Somers, Gertrudis Ramaeckers and Nicolaus Vanhees.
Then on 16-11-1746 Fredericus was baptised; mother Elisabetha Reijnders (= Reijnarts I think), witnesses Walterus Reijnders, Josephus van Hees, Walburgis Duckarts and Maria Berchems.
This Josephus van Hees might be a brother of Joannes.
Baptised in Heer on 26-01-1736: Joannes, father Josephus van Hees, mother Elisabeta Straels, witnesses Elisabeta van Hees, Joannes van Hees and Elisabeta Olmans.

Children of Nicolaus van Hees and Gertrudis Rameeckers (Raijmakers):
date place name (witnesses)
15-04-1706 Heer: Elisabetha (Severus Rameeckers, Nicolaus van Hees, Elisabetha van Hees)
19-03-1708 Joseph (Michael Coninckx, Cornelia van Hess)
11-03-1710 Catharina (Johanna van Hees, Fredericus Essenbach)
04-11-1711 Cornelia (Clara Rameeckers, Odilia Meijs, Hermannus Lousberch, Gerardus van Hees)
25-05-1713 Anna (Anna Rameeckers, Henricus Nelissen)
19-05-1715 Joannes (Anna van Hees, Gerardus Claessen)
24-02-1717 Mathias (Petrus Pieters, Anna van Hees)
18-12-1718 Maria Catharina (Maria Catharina Conincx, Lambertus van Hees)
07-05-1722 Lambertus (Godefridus Conincx, Joannes Frints, Beatrix Frambachs)

The parents of Nicolaas are Lambertus van Hees and Elisabeth Herda(e)nen. They got married 02-02-1680 Heer.
Their children:
Ouders : Van Hees, Lambertus en ?, Elisabeth

Doop Geborene
Heer, 09-09-1681 Van Hees Elisabetha
Heer, 29-09-1683 Van Hees Nicolaus
Heer, 25-07-1686 Van Hees Cornelia
Heer, 29-04-1689 Van Hees Joanna
Heer, 25-08-1691 Van Hees Gerardus
Heer, 02-07-1693 Van Hees Gerardus
Heer, 28-07-1696 Van Hees Anna
Heer, 15-03-1699 Van Hees Lambertus

bronnen
Petrus Banden: DHO register 1654 - 1700 , in Heer
Petrus Banden: DH register 1696 - 1769 , in Heer

I think this is the birth of Elisabeth Herdaenen:
Doop Heer 24-02-1655
Dopeling Elisabetha Herdaenen
Vader van de dopeling Nicolaus Herdaenen
Moeder van de dopeling Cornelia N.n.
Doopgetuige Hermanus Lijnssen
Doopgetuige Joanna Hermans
Helena zei op 8 april 2011 om 02:33
As Mariët -[in topic Re: Van Hees help!]- suggested to you : Ask your question at the prikbord of the 'Regionaal Historisch Centrum Limburg'. (just looked and spotted your question already there. Hopefully someone is thinking about it and doing a bit of research for you in the RHCL. Fingers crossed!). Or place your question in a forum specifically aimed at Limburg. At the moment - as others pointed out already- not much (yet?) available from this area and era via the internet.

Nicolaas van Hees [who married in 1767 in Grave] was a soldier; keep in mind that soldiers moved around a lot, not just for military actions but also moving from garrison to garrison. Perhaps the reason why your ancestor Nicolaas [from Heer near Maastricht] ended up in Grave, married in that [garrison] place in 1767 while he was actually at that time in garrison in Zutphen as noted in the marriage entry. Zutphen (in Gelderland) was a garrsion place as well.

It could well be that his father was a soldier too? Often more in one family were in the 'Staatse Leger'. Then you can expect children to be born in different (garrison) places. [I have a few soldiers in my research and found children born in Maastricht, Deventer, Breda etc. I could follow the families by knowing the Regiment they were in as noted in one of the the 'original' entries; the Regiment's name was not in the index on-line. Another reason I always prefer to see the 'original' entry!]

Not sure when you ancestor Nicolaas van Hees [born in Heer as noted in 1767 in Grave] left the army, but he is recorded as living in Grave at the time of his death on 17 October 1807; then 64 years old. Further noted that he lived with 3 children in Brakken Wijk B nr. 45. [Perhaps you will find this interesting reading: http://www.milwiki.nl/milwiki/index.php?n=Onderzoek.Lezing-Wolters01a [put it into Google translate and use a bit of imagination when the translation does not make sense :)].

The parents of this Nicolaas could well be the Joannes van Hees and Elisabeta Maria Reijnart as suggested in your other topic. Was father [Joannes] perhaps also a soldier is a question that arises in my thoughts.
Can only find (in the GenDaLIm cd) two children born in Heer form this couple:
Baptism Heer 22-03-1744
Baptized child Nicolaus Vanhees
Father of the child Joannes Vanhees
Mother of the child Elisabeta Reijnarts
Sponsor Catharina Somers
Sponsor Gertrudis Rameckers (she could be the gr. mother of the child?)
Sponsor Nicolaus Vanhees (could be the gr. father or uncle?)

Baptism Heer 16-11-1746
Baptized child Fredericus Vanhees
Father of the child Joannes Vanhees
Mother of the child Elisabeta Reijnders
Sponsor Walterus Reijnders
Sponsor Josephus Van Hees (could be the uncle? brother of the father)
Sponsor Walburgis Duckarts
Sponsor Maria Berchems

I would try to search for more children; elsehwere? in garrison places? in Grave? Knowing the godparents at a baptism could lead you to finding and collating the family of grand-parents, uncles and aunties. With these two earlier baptisms in Heer as mentioned above (in 1744 and in 1746) there is already a good indication...

Now going back to the 3 baptisms in Grave in 1768, in 1771 and in 1777: Perhaps it was grandfather Joannes van Hees who was a sponsor at the baptism of Nicolaas' first-born son: Joannes Fredericus on 13-12-1768 in Grave. And the other godparent - Fredericus van Hees - at the baptism of Henricus Frederikus on in Grave on 01-12-1771 could well be an uncle of the child (brother of the father)?
Helena zei op 8 april 2011 om 02:48
As I just paced my previous reaction I saw that - during the time I was writing my say - Dorethé placed a reaction too. Yes Dorethé, that is what I thought as well.

What we don't know yet: The marriage date of Nicolaus van Hees and Gertrudis Rameeckers , neither yet) if Joseph ~ 1708 was their first-born son. If so, then I would have expected this child to be baptised Lambertus since the grandafther's name was Lambertus. Perhaps there was an earlier child (baptised elsewhere?) already named Lambertus and who died before 1722 and then a next son was named Lambertus? V ery unusal otherwise to have a Lambertus as the last child and after a Joseph and a Joannes and a Matthias.
Helena zei op 8 april 2011 om 02:57
Tim, -- Please note that these names come from the transcriptions as found on the GenDaLim cd.
Helena zei op 8 april 2011 om 03:30
@ Tim - Some further info which might interest you: Transcription Nederduits Gereformeerde Gemeente ZUTPHEN Trouwboek 1751-1775 (R.B.S. 1891)Tijdvak 1764-1775:

21.06.1767 Nicolaas van Hees, j.m., sold. in 't battaillon van Deutz, in g.a. - Theodora Kuitenbrouwer, wede. van Derk Vermout, w. te Gave.
Attest, na Graave 5 jul. 1767.

Link: http://www.genealogiedomein.nl/index.php?option=com_docman&task=cat_view&gid=378&Itemid=27

In BHIC : In the Doop-, Trouw- en Begraafregisters (DTB) | Grave | 1748-1786 | Trouwen --> scan 262 van 444 it says that he was 'geboortig van Heere onder Maastricht, soldaat in het battaillon van den Heere Generael Luijtenant Deutz, ter compagnie van den heer Collonel W:E: Snoukaart van Schouburg, in guarnisoen te Zutphen.

Combining all the info I am confident this Nicolaas was the son of Joannes van Hees and Elisabeta Reijnarts.

The other Nicolaas born in Heer around that time (10 years ealrier) was the son of Josephus; this Nicolaas will be his older cousin:
Baptism Heer 27-12-1734
Baptized child Nicolaus Vanhees
Father of the child Josephus Vanhees
Mother of the child Elisabetha Fraets
Sponsor Catharina Vanhees
SponsorHenricus Olmans
Norah zei op 8 april 2011 om 12:24
The name Olmans in Helena's last message is probably Dolmans, far more common.
Tim (uit Canada) zei op 8 april 2011 om 16:17
Wow. I am very thankful that so many considerate people read, and reply, to these forum messages. You truly are wonderful, thoughtful people. I will sort through all of the recent pieces of information that you wrote about, and try to see where it all fits in to my family stamboom. My words cannot truly express my appreciation!!! Sincerely, Tim

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